Wednesday, February 13, 2008

This is why I was never friends with girls in high school

I visit thenest.com pretty regularly. It started when I became wedding obsessed before getting engaged and turned to theknot.com to help with planning all aspects of my wedding. Once I got back from our honeymoon and had that horrible wedding let-down depression that follows for many brides who have put so much time into planning a single event (in hindsight, I wish we had taken the money my parents offered and RUN! Vegas, baby!!:) I turned to the sister sight for married gals - thenest.com. There are boards for every single time of life. Boards for moms of babies of all ages, infertility boards, book discussion boards, travel boards, and even now an election 08 board. This is the board I would like to discuss. :)

I am a political junky. I think that's been established. And I was so excited to find a place with well-educated women who could discuss politics and the election without judging each other, but why is that not possible sometimes when large group of women get together? It makes me so sad. Last night, the conversation on the election board turned from politics and the election to stay at home moms. Why that topic of conversation you ask. Who in the world knows. You wouldn't believe the way some of these women came down on women who stay at home with their children. It bothered me more than I can say. To me, feminism is about having a CHOICE. Women have the freedom now to choose whatever path in life they want. So calling someone archaic because they stay home with their children, to me, is taking a step backwards. The second argument on the board occured when one poster said she had never met a stay home mom who is interesting. Hello stereotypes? Isn't that what all of us tolerant, open-minded people are supposed to avoid? Some of these women pride themselves on being so super-tolerant of all people. There are threads and threads of conversation regarding tolerance and open mindedness. Okay, so you're accepting of everyone but me because I am my child's full time care giver? I just don't get that.

I'll quote here the post entitled "Okay, talk me down: Most of you know my distaste for SAHMs. And yes, I realize it's their choice and bladdy bladdy. I get that.Here's my deal.I've never met one that I really could relate to. That didn't have their world completely revolving around their children, their house, their DH." Distaste for stay at home moms? You are kidding me. The post had many comments - some from stay at home moms arguing their value as a person and others from women supporting this poster's view point. It boggles my mind; it really does. One of my personal favorite responses was, "I'd rather have bamboo chutes stuck under my fingernails than to carry on a conversation about daycare and soap operas." Nice. Why in the world do we do this to each other? These women have the total right to make their own choices. And I was a working woman before Lily was born. But you know what? My career choice doesn't define me. We are far more than just our jobs. I have a Master's Degree. And to that some women on the board responded that women like me who have higher education degrees are marginalized by staying home and are hurting other women who choose their careers because the glass ceiling is harder to break through when employers know women "like me" aren't in their careers for the long haul. Wow. I'm well-educated, and I made the informed decision that was right for me and my family. Why should anyone judge another person for that? And to say just because I stay home, I'm probably not interesting because my world is my child and soap operas? HA. I don't watch soaps. I watch MSNBC almost all day. And so what if I did watch a soap. I'm sure lots of working moms Tivo a soap opera or two. And yes, my child probably is the center of my world. Same goes for women who choose to work outside the home. Working outside the home doesn't mean your child isn't the center of your world. We have to all do what is right for us. My decisions aren't right for every woman and vice versa.

I guess my main point is that I get so disgusted and saddened by the way some women treat other women. Think of the good we could do if we stopped judging and tearing down each other and focused on supporting one another. This community is special that way. It's one thing I am grateful to infertility for (I never thought I'd ever say that!). But, it's something that makes me crazy about being a woman. The men just have a slug fest and get over it. They don't care and don't focus that much on judging each other (this is what my husband believes. I discussed the posts with him last night, and he just shook his head and said, "Girls are dumb." :) I think he's working on a club house out back and will post a big sign that says "No girls allowed." ) Anyway, to wrap it up and step down off my soap box, I am so proud to be a woman. I read all these blogs and feel so amazed at what we have come through and how we've handled it with grace and by never giving up and always supporting each other. Why can't that translate? We need to give each other a break! Well, maybe "we" don't, but THOSE women do! :) Whew...I'm worn out. When do the soaps come on? :)

25 comments:

Anonymous said...

WOW!!! I don't even know what to say...I'm stunned. I guess I just never thought about people judging me for being a SAHM. I have always just felt so incredibly lucky that my husband can provide for our family so that I actually CAN stay at home with our girls. There is so much more that I could say about this subject but I will just keep my big mouth shut :) I will just say DITTO to everything you said, Katd! My feathers got really ruffled reading that so I guess I'd better just stay away from "the nest" or I'll get myself in trouble.

Laurie

beagle said...

There are plenty of working moms who are boring as hell too.

If her point was that some mothers get so focused on motherhood that they forget to be an individual too, then she has a point, EXCEPT that she lost her point when she made it about whether that woman stays home or works outside the home.

There are plenty or dynamic interesting SAHM's and many boring career moms and vice versa.

Women could stand to be kinder to each other but in gereneral that cattyness kind of wins out too often.

Lori Lavender Luz said...

I don't get it. There is such a human urge to divide people into "Us" and "Them" groups. Why?

I have distaste for people who have distaste for other people.

I guess proving the Us and Them point.

Anonymous said...

Great post!

I don't know why women have a hard time accepting that what is right for them may not be right for the next woman.

Rachel

Anonymous said...

Amen, Sister! I'm also a SAHM who's well-educated and who left a career as a state investigator and analyst behind in order to care for my family and home. And I couldn't be happier.

I don't know who they think they're kidding if career women don't think their entire existence is wrapped up in their jobs just like ours are. For SAHMs, our kids and our homes ARE our job. I don't see a difference. Being home and responsible for these little lives is a high calling and one of the hardest jobs I've ever done in my life. And the most rewarding.

For the record, I don't watch any daytime television. At all. *grin*

I have a friend, a very high-powered attorney, who is absolutely miserable and who is sadly watching her daughters' lives slipping by as someone else raises them for her. She's considering joining the rank and file of the SAHM sisterhood and I'm loudly cheering for her!

Women, by and large, don't treat each other well. That's why all of the best friends I had before a few years ago were guys.

GLouise said...

Oh barf.

First of all, if people think I am boring, so be it! LOL.

Second- those debates always amuse me at some point, because we all go through different "seasons" in life. Just b/c I am a SAHM right now, does not mean I will be next year or the following year.

It is not like it is a life sentence of 18 years!!

Those arguments are always based on the premise that you have to make an "all or nothing" choice right now, when in fact, some of us work part time, full time, AT home or not for a paying job at all.

It is such an old, tired argument!!!

Kandi said...

I completely agree with you on this point. I would love to be a SAHM but alas, I don't have any children yet (not even married yet) so I am still slugging away at my career. I have a ton of respect for SAHM's though. My Mom was one and it worked wonderfully for us. I hope to be able to do the same but where I live the cost of living is super high.. only time will tell.

katd said...

You guys make such great points! I love what Lori says about the "us" and "them" divide. It's so often about that, and it shouldn't be. And beagle is right to say there are plenty of working moms who are boring as hell:) I had to giggle. :)

Anonymous said...

I agree that women are way too hard on themselves and often way too quick to judge other women.

You're a political junkie? So cool...

katd said...

OH Mayhem, don't even get me started:) I can't get enough of it. I'm thinking of driving over and volunteering in Ohio for the primary. Ours isn't until May and I can't wait that long. :)

hope548 said...

It is awful at times how women attack each other! I believe every mother must make her own choice. I can't afford to be a SAHM, and I honestly like working and think I'd be bored. Granted I don't have a baby yet, and obviously that could all change! However, I would NEVER judge a woman for wanting to stay home with her child(ren). Live and let live! Nobody is hurting the feminist movement!

Anonymous said...

Well said, well said!!

Jess said...

lol!!

Some people, I swear.

Minnie said...

I think you bring up a VERY strong point in that it's the ability to make that choice.
Hang in there. If it helps, people, clearly think you're interesting, or we wouldn't keeping popping by your blog.

Gretchen said...

WOW! how to even respond to that! I wholeheartedly agree with you. It is ridiculous how we treat each other. Feminism IS a choice. The choice for us to be able to do whatever we feel is right for us. My mother fought hard for this right for me and I thanks her for it. I am a proud SAHM with 2 degrees and I think I am very interesting! :)

Jessica C said...

So - I am usually just a lurker - excited that good things are happening in the infertal world but I had to comment. I wanted to say that I agree with you. I am not very political but that is the reason I believe we won't really get a woman in office anytime soon. We as women as a whole are a divided group. We have people that want a woman prez but ONLY because she is a powerful status symbol and would prove something to the SAHM's. In the same breath we have SAHM's that DO judge those who choose to work outside the home too. It is a disgrace that we can't stop judging and realize that WE HAVE A CHOICE and we are individuals and we are using that right to CHOOSE!!! I agree with you - we just need to get along and stop judging or imposing one's beliefs as the standard.

Thank you for your post on this.

Happy Valentine's Day too!

Esther Noelle said...

I could not agree with you more! When did feminism become about being like a man? No, it's about being proud to be a woman and do what I want. Having a choice. I think feminism should be more about valuing our innate womanly qualities - valuing FEMALES. Not trying to act like men. We should be proud to be women and have equal opportunities. Wow, I have to say though I'm not surprised that you found that on The Nest.... it is kind of like high school....

I LOVE staying home with my son and am so grateful for this chance to do so!

Melissa :) said...

This is why I now have no friends. Good friends. Friends that are loyal & you can count on. :)

I have not read all the comments because of time but...obviously this "lady" wanted a rise & she got one. It's more than evident that she *thinks* she is better than everyone, when she couldn't be further from the truth.

Being a mother is the most rewarding & difficult "job" a person could have. It's also one of the highest honors a person could have. And should this lady have 1/2 a brain, she would know that stay-at-home moms work harder than she could ever even think about. :)

Melissa :) said...

PS - did you ever read the post on my blog titled "just a mom"??? Very similar.

Another Day said...

Oh wow. I read that post too. I have to tell you tho that that particular nestie is notorious for stirring it up. She has made the rounds of different boards on there and is usually chased off/or gets bored and moves onto the next board. The election board must be her next victim.
Another FYI. About 6 months ago she was posting the total opposite post. It's best to ignore her.

Lily is getting so big!

Another Day said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Missy said...

I live in the burbs, where SAHMs seem to outnumber the working moms. So I have not personally come across this but I have friends who have.

It is part of the reason I stay off of message boards now. I just don't have the time or energy for all the nastiness that inevitably goes on. It is also why I am SO glad not to be working, because I was always in female dominated fields where all this drama unfolded on a daily basis.

I am safe in my little bubble of Christian mommy blogs, where I have never gotten anything but sweet supportive comments. I mean, I post that I have insomnia, and random strangers across the country pray for me! And I do the same for them! BIZARRE! And so beautiful!

One day I ventured and read some non-Christian mommy blogs and their comments and, sheesh. I crawled back home to my safe bubble with my tail between my legs.

Alison said...

I'm a working (out of the home) mom, and I agree with your post. It's all about the fact that we have the choice, and people (women especially) just need to stop judging and making this into "Us vs. Them" and just realize that everyone does what works best for their family.

That said (and like another commentor mentioned) there is plenty of backlash against "working moms" (especially those that choose to work). Much of it is kind of backhanded ("as someone else raises them for her..." - I don't know this person's situation, but it's a major annoyance of WMs when people say they're not "raising" their kids)

FWIW, I think SAH is an admirable choice if it works for your family and it's what you want. I was raised by a very happy SAHM and had a great childhood. But there are many different ways to be a good parent. People just need to stop worrying about what choices other families make.

mamadiva said...

Great post! Lol!

It's true. I don't know why we have to tear each other down. I have a group of friends including working and sahm's and even among friends I think that the us/them mentality comes out sometimes. I love being a sahm, but I can completely understand not everyone does. We all love our kids and that's the point.

Love your posts!

Anonymous said...

Anyone who posts drivel like that is just insecure in her own choice, trying to make herself feel better by tearing others down.